About me
A bachelor living in Delhi, a city he loves and loathes, documents his experiences on this page. He is erratic, opinionated and lazy, loves his women, wine and song - what more do you need to know?
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Thursday, March 4
Why I will vote for BJP..
Elections are around the corner, the pre-poll heat is already on, alliances will be formed shortly... so what will I do on voting day?
I will make sure I queue up outside my polling booth, get my finger imprinted with indelible ink, go inside and press the button which has the lotus symbol next to it.
Am I from a Jansangh-i family? Am I a manuwadi? Do I support what Narendra Modi overtly or covertly did in Guajarat? The answer to all these questions is a firm NO. But I have my reasons and let me share them with you.
1. Atal Bihari Vajpayee: Age may be against him but here is a man who is a superb cross between a liberal and a conservative. He has age-old wisdom which frames his conviction and yet he has the vision to think ahead. He knows how to pamper to small, niche constituencies while not compromising on issues that really affect the country. Just like Rajiv Gandhi revolutionised the telecom sector with his vision, Vajpayee's dream of the Golden Quadrilateral will change the way we commute and will make the country energy-efficient as well as cost-competitive globally. He is respected the world over for his astuteness and dynamic leadership, qualities you do not generally associate with an old man with wobbly knees.
2. Lal Krishna Advani: A perfect foil and a counterweight to Vajpayee. The man is like a strict school principal who will make the kids stand in the sun for several hours if he feels its good for them. No-nonsense and very sharp, he is unlike any other politician in the country. He will refuse to talk with extremists at their terms, even if it makes him unpopular, if he thinks it will be counter-productive. I would like to see him as Prime Minister after Vajpayee kicks the bucket.
3. Corruption: By far, this has been one of the cleanest governments in recent memory. The biggest 'scandals' have involved a minister asking his ministry to furnish his house or another buying coffins from a vendor who does not have the lowest quote or a party president accepting some five lac rupees from someone who insists - and these are laughable at best. Compare with the US where vice-presidents prod a moron president to send out thousands of young soldiers in pursuit of WMDs primarily to benefit his previous employers. The top players (Vajpayee, Advani, George Fernandes, Yashwant Sinha, Jaswant Singh, Sushma Swaraj etc) are honest and/ or seen to be honest unlike previous governments where the PMs themselves were accused of (and widely believed to have) receiving suitcases from stockbrokers, arms dealers, tantriks etc.
4. Consistency: The government has been consistent except for some minor flip-flops attributed to Vajpayee, which I believe has been pre-meditated in order to convey a message to different individuals or stakeholders without taking an irreversible stand. The government strongly condemned the riots in Gujarat and took prompt action to curb what is undoubtedly the one dark chapter in their tenure. That Modi went on to become CM even after this is a 'weakness' inherent in a democracy.
5. Foreign policy: That they have managed to safeguard India's interests in the face of tremendous support to Pakistani dictatorship for non-India-centric reasons is an accomplishment. By focussing on the economy as a diplomatic tool they diverted attention from the traditional "look-Pakistan-and-China-are-troubling-me" victim mindset on to the Shining India which is a favoured investment destination.
6. No alternative: I would hate to have an Italian-born Rabri Devi as our Prime Minister even if he wears recycled Indira Gandhi sarees and speaks what is supposed to be Hindi out of roman-lettered texts.
7. Secularism: Against all fears that they will indulge in Muslim-bashing and will build the Ram temple bulldozing any opposition, Vajpayee and his government (mind you, the party has an agenda and what they do is their business as long as it does not affect the governance) have proven to be rational and statesman-like. Muslims are as safe in India as before and their voices are heard on all major fora, even though the traditional appeasemsnt which benefitted only the elite has reduced.
I sincerely hope they get a full majority on their own so that the unfinished agendas of divestment, infrastructure-building and Kashmir are sorted out in their next term.
Posted at 3/4/2004 11:10:00 am by Ranjan
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Sunday, February 29
I desist from making plugs for any blog because I feel everyone should discover on their own.
But here is one that I can't help referring strongly, partly because it talks about my alma mater and partly because its so easy, lucid and genuine. It will also give all IIM-aspirants a peek into what life there is all about... go check it out.
Posted at 2/29/2004 9:39:28 am by Ranjan
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Friday, February 27
The mutual-ness of co-existence
The fifth-floor apartment I live in is frequented by loads of pigeons. They make noise all day around and if the balcony door is left open, they come in and roam around the flat like it was their own. At night one can hear their soft but distinct muttering (as they woo each other?). Everyday the maid complains about the goo they leave behind.
I was telling this to my friend's father and he started talking about the kind of experiences they had when they moved in to NOIDA about 15 years back. Apparently, there were wild animals of all kinds that would cross the streets as you drove through and appear at doorsteps at night. Some new residents even had rough encounters resulting to injuries of various levels. There were many snake- bites, tetanus infections etc.
Talking to him gave me a new perspective. Is it the pigeons who are intruding on my space or is it the other way around?
Over time, it was the birds who were supposed to fly, and hence occupy the upper levels of space. Mankind was meant to share the ground level with other animals who were equipped with legs to walk on. The crawly creatures (snakes, worms) would lead their lives under the soil.
Maybe the pigeons that live on my balcony still believe what is true for their friends living elsewhere where there are no multi-storied apartments - that this level belongs to them. They must have been bewildered when these concrete monoliths would have sprung up in their play area and maybe they resent it even now.
Every new habitation in recent times has displaced an old ecosystem. Townships like Mayur Vihar, Dwarka, Sarita Vihar, Noida and Gurgaon have been built on what was a wasteland. We have dug up the soil for a strong foundation for our skyscrapers and in the process dislodged the snakes who have no other way than to look for prey over the ground. We have destroyed the jungles that ones housed the cheetahs, langurs, monkeys and wild dogs. Now they have become refugees who will go anywhere - including where we live.
I will tell this to my maid. Hope she understands.
Posted at 2/27/2004 2:46:17 pm by Ranjan
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Monday, February 23
There is a part of me which has serious entrepreneurial dreams, if only it could triumph over the larger and stronger scared part which always takes over. I will have some kind of a small business before I finish, but that's not the subject of this post.
I keep noticing the small details and examples of good/ bad customer experience wherever I go. Here are a few samples:
- I wanted to buy a diamond for my sister and as always had postponed the purchase till the last day. I remembered at about 7 on the day before her birthday and rushed to Connaught Place. Those who know Delhi know that most shops in CP close by 7 and so I was met by downed shutters at Tanishq, Gili and Asmi outlets. I am walking through the circle and notice this hole-in-the-wall in C-block with a few customers inside and so rush towards it. The guard tells me its closed so I request him to ask the manager who comes out and I beg him to allow me inside so I can buy the jewellery and I promise him I will be out in 10 minutes. He says no sir, we are closed, please come tomorrow. I bought the Rs. 13500 merchandise from another shop next day.
- At Ebony I bought this fancy tea-set. On its first morning in my butterfingers, I poured hot water into the pot while it rested on the cold marble slab. Predictably, it cracked. I called Ebony with the fullest confidence that they would say tough luck chum. Surprise! They said, we are sorry sir, why don't you return it and we will give you vouchers against it in case you do not like any replacment piece. Since then its Ebony I turn to whenever I want to but something big.
- I had bought some small gift from Bombay for one of my friends who I had a crush on and I was meeting her at Priya. Since I had not got the gift wrapped when I bought it, I panicked and went from shop to shop asking if they would wrap it for me. No luck at Neoplanet, none at the Archies' Gallery so I hopelessly sauntered into the pharmacy store next to Senso. The very helpful lady said no we do not wrap outside gifts, no not even if you pay for it. But listen, if you buy a small thing here (I thought I saw it coming, so here I am expected to shell out big cash!) we could do it for you, free. So, we go around choosing the small thing... she suggests I buy the chocolates which were just Rs. 15 apiece! I picked two and she went happily inside and came out with the best wrap I have seen in a while.
There must be many more such experiences you may have had, care to share them?
Posted at 2/23/2004 5:59:22 pm by Ranjan
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Thursday, February 19
"What do you think of the fee cut?"
Its funny how even bystanders have started getting involved in the raging IIM controversy.
I was travelling on Valentine Day eve and was quietly standing in the queue to check in. It was a not-too-cold-yet-not-so-warm day so I was wearing a sweatshirt which happened to have an IIM slogan (you know those corny ones that all of us snobs have?). I was lost in the thoughts of work and the prospect of what I would do after landing, when I hear someone say from behind, "So, what do you think of the fee cut?"
After check-in I go to the Welcomgroup coffee shop (only because my Amex Gold card gets me coffee and lots of space, gratis! I am a cheapskate!) and there are these off-duty air-hostesses chattering away. They also notice my branding and one of them leans across and asks, "So, what do you think of the fee cut?"
In the plane I have this middle-aged-bordering-on-old lady with a stern look who, without as much as a how do you do, repeats the question with little variation.
My only response to all these curious citizens: I don't think much about it. I only hope they reduce the fees with retrospective effect and give me back my investment. Also, why is it so much of a national issue? I know of several classmates who came from economically challenged backgrounds but had no problem getting their courses financed and who are doing exceedingly well in their careers thanks to the Central Bank of India.
There is an article on Rediff which presents a contrary view. Do read it when you have the time.
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Are IIMs accountable? If so to whom?
February 17, 2004
These are interesting times and interesting times are challenging times. There is a furore among some sections of the elite about the ministry of human resources development's recent directive to reduce the fee charged from IIM students. Normally one expects lots of enthusiasm for such a step. But in these globalising and reformist times more the fees the merrier [at least for those who are not prospective students.]
Let us look at some issues closely:
1.There is an 80 percent reduction in fees, from Rs 1.5 lakhs per annum to Rs 30,000 by the government order -- it is unfair.
The annual fees [excluding mess charges] have been increased from Rs 3,000 in 1991-1992 to Rs 1.5 lakhs in 2003-2004 which is a CAGR [compounded annual growth rate] of nearly 40 percent. Any economist would be amazed.
In these 12 years nothing has grown at this annual rate -- inflation, student strength, price of books, faculty size or salary and buildings. The first major fees increase in 1992-93 was undertaken by the IIMs to around Rs 8,000 with an understanding that an increase of around 10 to 15 percent or inflation rate [whichever is higher] will be made each year and on that basis the fees today, after these 11 years, would be around Rs 40,000 only.
The market can bear argument is not tenable when the IIMs are in a monopoly situation. Out of every hundred aspirants only one is admitted. By keeping the intake numbers low the IIMs have created scarcity with a dominant monopoly principle.
2. The board of the IIMs is the supreme authority in financial matters.
It is interesting that very recently [one week before] when the government announced [in the vote on account] the merger of 50 percent DA [dearness allowance] with basic pay, it was immediately implemented by the IIMs. This time nobody argued that the IIM board should discuss it and may reject this proposal. When it is convenient, the board's 'autonomy' is forgotten and the IIMs follow the ministry's instructions immediately.
The IIMs [for those not familiar] are not companies. They are societies which are creatures of the central government under the Registrar of Societies Act of the respective states. The memorandum of articles of association of the IIMs has not vested the board with financial decisions, pertaining to fees.
3. Students in higher education should not be given subsidy.
The IIM controversy: Complete Coverage
Fair enough. But from the canteen to electricity [24 hours] to housing to Internet [24 hours] to plumbing to garbage disposal in the IITs/IIMs, everything is very highly subsidized. For instance, the market rent for a three bedroom house with garage plus servant quarters with attached garden and full time security is around Rs 30,000 per month in many cities. But inside the IITs/IIMs people pay only Rs 1,500 to 2,000. How come the subsidy argument fails then? The argument on subsidies is a much larger issue not just applicable to students in institutions of higher learning only.
4. Can the IIMs manage with this reduced fee?
By all means. They can and will earn extra from sponsored research/consulting/executive programmes etc. Since, on these activities there are no 'fees' restrictions.
5. Bank loans are there.
Incidentally, one of the closely guarded secrets in our country is the percentage of NPA [non performing assets] in the loans given to IIT/IIM students. A couple of years ago one of the IIMs published a long list of defaulters [wilful defaulters] year-wise in their alumni magazine. But everybody thought it was an honours list!!
Informed bankers suggest there is less default among cobblers and tailors. The alumnus, having two bytes on television, should repay and encourage others to repay for further loan flow. To overcome this problem educational loans should be recovered like TDS -- the onus on the employer -- with every pass certificate stamped as 'loanee.' The passport should also should bear a 'loanee' stamp [for recovery before travel abroad]. There are issues of collateral particularly for students coming from rural and average income backgrounds.
6. The surplus with all IITs/IIMs is very useful.
It is kept in central and state government securities [the investment norms are -- up to 90 percent should be in government securities]. Some state undertakings are in such a situation that there is a question mark on the interest and principle to be received by the IIMs. It is like our foreign exchange, kept in US treasury bills earning 3 percent. At least, let us hope the US treasury will honour its commitments! Just having a corpus is no fun unless massive construction etc activities are undertaken. Buildings/pensions etc are always funded by the government.
7. Financial surplus implies world class and autonomy.
Neither is automatically true. This is a typical American notion that financial strength implies 'freedom' and 'independent.' Actually throughout Indian history, sages and fakirs who were totally poor were independent and did not worry about opposing the rulers. During the sixties/seventies, IIMs were fully dependent on the government but still had total autonomy. Also to note, that many capitation fees charging street corner colleges are 'rich,' but that does not make them world class. People have chosen/choose to be teachers since it is considered as a passion by them and not as a vocation or career.
8. Cost cannot be covered.
The government did not say anything about research/executive programmes/consultancy/international programmes etc. They are relatively tougher tasks compared to increasing fees for students. IIMs can and do earn from those sources much more. Globally all business schools subsidise post graduate courses from research/consulting and executive programmes.
9. IIMs are self regulating and know how to maintain global quality and hence they should not be questioned.
In the context of global schools, there is something called tenure track [permanent] which may not be got by all the faculty. In IIM/IIT structure after two years everybody is permanent and till retirement nothing can be done to her/him unless s/he indulges in grave sexual/financial etc impropriety. For academic non-performance nobody has been sacked/penalised in the last forty years in our higher learning portals. Hence all comparison with US schools is meaningless.
10. The minister is saffronising IIMs.
Unless it is felt Mr N R Narayana Murthy, Mr S M Dutta [ex-HLL], Mr Yogi Deveshwar [ITC], Mr K V Kamath [ICICI], Mr Ajit Nambiar [BPL], Mr Venu Srinivasan [TVS] etc are all saffron! All these were appointed on various IIM boards by Dr Joshi. Actually some saffronites complain that he has not appointed them to these places!!
11. Dr Joshi's style of functioning is not good.
There may be a point in this. It is complained, that he does not consult with a large body of academicians etc. The same is the case with many political leaders. As a wag commented most of our politicians stand between two mirrors [like in a saloon] and make consultations to conclude that they had consulted infinite number of persons!!
12. Four areas are critical for functional autonomy:
- Curriculum
- Recruitment of students
- Recruitment of faculty
- Promotion/assessment of faculty
None of this is currently under any threat other than the feelings [like the feelings of Bush on WMD] that 'they may be affected in the future.' More than the mirage of financial autonomy what needs to be stressed and preserved is Functional Autonomy.
IIMs are tax exempt entities under the assumption that they are organizations not for making profits. But recently they are claiming they are making huge surplus. This does not seem to be compatible with the original educational objectives. The bottom line --Are IIMs accountable? If so, to whom?
In a democracy it has to be to Parliament and the ministry and in a sense to society at large since IIMs are public organizations. Unfortunately for an institution like the IIMs the bottom line can never be profit after or before tax.
It is also interesting to note that the corporates who are making lots of noises have not come forward with huge funding to the IIMs like Rockefeller or Fulbright Foundations. There is a school of thought among some of the 'reformers' and 'globalisers' that the IITs and IIMs should be handed over to the private sector and this view is supported by some corporate chieftains and some in the English media.
That would be a sad day for our educational edifice built with so much sagacity and foresight. There are enough corporate sector institutions to worry about top line and bottom line. Let there be some institutions at least, in our country which are solely concerned about pursuit of knowledge and preparation of future citizens based on contemplation and a passion for research and innovation. I rest my case.
Needless to add, all these are my views and are not of the organization to which I belong.
R Vaidyanathan is professor of finance and control at IIM, Bangalore. He obtained his Fellow in Management (Doctorate) from the Indian Institute of Management, Calcutta where he also taught for four years.
Posted at 2/19/2004 11:20:48 am by Ranjan
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Thursday, February 5
To the person I will marry...
I don't know who you are but I know I will find you one day.
Look me in the eye when we meet, and let me look into your soul.
Do not lie to me, and tell me if you don't like my appearance/ BO/ dressing sense.
Give me a direct answer when I go down on my knees and ask you, "Will you marry me?".
Shop for our wedding and put on your best smile for the occasion, its the only one we will have.
Talk about your dreams and fears when we cuddle up during our honeymoon.
Believe me.
Bring over the romance when we come back to our home but ensure you make breakfast.
Do not insist on me talking when I am visibly not in the mood to.
When in doubt, ask me. I will let you know.
Tell me "I have a headache" before and not after. I will understand.
Don't take my answer at face value when you ask me, "Am I looking good?".
I will try never to break you heart. But I may fail sometimes.
If you do not like any of my friends, do not show it to them. Tell me.
Tell me if you don't like my habits, but say it only once, maybe twice, no more.
Try to love my parents like I do. More will be much appreciated.
Treat my money as our money.
Lets take a week-long holiday every year.
Lets try and not miss my/ your/ our favourite acts/ movies/ plays when they come to town.
Tell me when you ready to have a baby. We will make them together.
I will help you change nappies, but don't shout if I am clumsy.
Lets raise the child (ren?) in the way both of us feel fit. And lets give them our best.
Lets not regret if they don't come up to our high expectations.
Make sure either one of us (preferably both) goes to their PTAs.
When we grow older, lets hold hands at least once every day.
If I die before you, take care of the family and do not shed tears.
We will meet again up there.
I will still love you.
Posted at 2/5/2004 11:24:15 am by Ranjan
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Wednesday, February 4
Anyone who knows this stuff?
I got this very flattering e-mail from Nandita, which also asked me something I know nothing about:
Hi Ranjan,
I trust you're well. I've been having a bit of a problem with your
blog: I don't seem to be able to access it from the (Linux) machine I
use -- the page opens up but only the title 'Small Talk' shows up and I
quite simply cannot read what you've posted. I wanted to ask you
whether you know of any way I can circumvent the prob.. I've been
reading your blog at cyber cafes recently, and to be honest, it's kind
of expensive for me to do that.
Best wishes,
N Saikia
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Can anyone help? Please post it in the comments or write directly to Nandita on nansaikia@yahoo.co.uk
Posted at 2/4/2004 10:36:33 am by Ranjan
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Saturday, January 31
A treat for the senses...
We went to a show at the British Council last night, my attendance made possible thanks to Sandhya who was kind enough to ask if I wanted to fill in for her husband Rohit.
The show (wonder if it can be called a play?) was titled The Summit and was loosely based on the Reagan- Gorbachev talks of the mid-eighties. In it, two brothers (RalfRalf, yes that's what they call themselves) occupy the stage for 70 minutes and put up an amazing show of subtle comedy, intense physicality and deep political statement-making - all without any decipherable language! They are ostensibly two world leaders who are engaged in a Summit in full public view. Their languages are different (both improvised languages, made entirely of sounds and syllables not found in any modern language).
On the face of it, it is classical comedy at its best, much in the mould of the Chaplin movies where the players evoke laughter through their everyday actions and behaviour. The lady sitting next to me was in splits all through and I can understand.
But the play also had deeper undertones.
At one level it exposed the superficiality of international politics. There are these bozos who are propped up by public opinion and who are only puppets in the hands of those who pull the strings. The actions as well as expressions of these people are based on what they are tutored about, and they look over the shoulder after every step they take in any direction. They themselves are insignificant as individuals. Here is the futility of personality-oriented diplomacy.
At another level, it threw up the question of whether modern civilisation has any strong basis. Today, our existence as individuals, families, nations and cultures is based on the thought that we are defined by our language and/ or 'organised' means of expressions. The other animals are inhuman because they are not so disciplined in how they express their thoughts. And you are a Gujarati, Bangladeshi or German based on the language that you speak. What if each individual spoke in different languages? What if what I call a computer, you call a salmon? Would we still understand each other? And if no, how important is verbal understanding?
Catch it if it comes to your city. You will not be disappointed.
p.s. Once again I was surprised at how we become uncomfortable with silence. Have you noticed that the moment lights go out and there is a pause before a performance, many of us start coughing? And that our heartbeat becomes irregular?
Posted at 1/31/2004 4:54:41 pm by Ranjan
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Tuesday, January 27
Its amazing how a great plan can be made over a great bottle of Cabernet.
On Saturday we were having out customary weekend drink when one curious drunken soul wondered aloud, "What are we going to do for the long weekend? [Monday was India's 54th Republic Day and so a national holiday]. I, who had never taken his car out of town, volunteered to drive out to Jaipur. Within about 6 hours of our alcohol propelled decision, we were on our way.
Remember those days as school children when we went for the annual picnics? We did, as we sang a full-throated cacophony till our ear-drums could take it no more, and we pointed out cheerfully to sights we had always missed on our way to office. There was a sandwich casserole, thanks to my friend's wife, and a fruit basket which we picked into at regular intervals.
The road from Delhi to Jaipur is newly laid and has a beautiful construction. Its a toll road, so the traffic is much regulated and moves at reasonably high speeds. There are mustard fields all through the way, and at many points, the road looks like it has been freshly pulled out from the looming hillocks. The sun played hide-and-seek with us as we sped through shadows of small but majestic, old and denuded mounds of earth. There were bougainvilleas planted on the road dividers that gave immense joy to the senses.
We were received by an old colleague who is also a dear friend. He whisked us immediately to a game of polo. It was the finals of the Sirmour Cup and was attended by the who's who of India's royalty. Let me confess here that while I have no particular weakness for celebrities of any kind (unlike my friend, Alphas mom!), blue blood always has held a special fascination.
When I saw Maharani Gayatri Devi, seated two rows ahead of us, I went week in the knees and I walked up to her, fearing the worst. She was kind and cordial and summoned a photographer! I am sure I must have been looking like a complete jackass and I hope it doesnt show in the picture! She spoke with me for over 5 minutes and, boy, is she gorgeous! She has so much class and elegance
she must have been a stunner when she was young, at 85 or so, she has that sparkle in her eyes that makes hearts go round in circles. Thereafter my friend formally introduced to the Maharaja (a suave man in his 60s and the Maharanis stepson) Brigadier Bhawani Singh, and it was a great experience too.
Rest of the trip was full of surprises. I met someone who I hadnt met for 14 years and hadnt expected to meet! We drove all the way to Chokhi Dhani only to be told that the place is booked for the evening. And the biggest surprise was the realization that I could drive for over 660 kms and not be fatigued at all! I love my Ikon!!
I am considering another break on the next weekend. Game? Mail me on yayaawar@yahoo.com.
Posted at 1/27/2004 3:26:33 pm by Ranjan
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Thursday, January 22
I have had a most disturbing experience this week.
On saturday, we went to watch a movie at the Wave cineplex in Noida. They have recently started valet parking and so we left the key with the driver and sped off into the theatre. After the truly engaging movie ( "Ek hasina thi") got over and we came down, I noticed my wallet was missing... racking my brain, I realised I had left it in the car. When the valet brought in the vehicle, sure enough, the wallet was not there where I left it. My heart sank.
After putting in the mandatory complaint with the parking contractor, I went about calling up the banks to block my cards. At HDFC with whom I have my salary account, they told me I would have to go to the branch to do the paperwork and yes sir, we do not work sundays. I told myself its harmless anyways as debit cards are more secure than credit cards.
On sunday I was just checking my account balance when I saw four transactions on my debit card adding up to Rs. 27000 (~ USD 600). And they were surely not mine. So I called up HDFC again. This time they blocked my card to contain any further damage.
Now comes the most amazing part. The HDFC person tells me he cannot do anything as he has no record of me having called them to block the card. And, no, the merchant is not responsible to check the signature on the charge slip and match it with that on the card. But my Citibank Suvidha debit card works only with a PIN, I ask. That's because they have Maestro and your card was a Visa Electron. So why was I not given a Maestro? Why did no one ever tell me that anyone can borrow my card for a while and charge whatever amount he fancies and does not even have to bother about duplicating my signature?? What redressal do I have? Not much, Sir, but you can ask for a Charge-back. What is a Chargeback? We will pass on your request to Visa who will investigate and if they establish it wasn't you, you MIGHT get credit. How long will it take? 60 to 90 days Sir.
Lessons:
1. Do not use valet parking if you can avoid it. If not, make sure you have no belongings (I used to leave my laptop in the trunk, not any more) left in the car.
2. Make sure you immediately have your cards blocked if you lose them, even if it means you have to queue up at the only branch in the city that works sundays and that is 40 kms away.
3. If you hold a debit card, and its a Visa, cut it into pieces and ask for a Maestro.
Posted at 1/22/2004 3:14:15 pm by Ranjan
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